Estrogen Dominance and Adrenal Fatigue with CBS (++)/MTHFR (++) ?

This topic contains 3 replies, has 1 voice, and was last updated by  Dolores Seames 1 year, 2 months ago.

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  • February 4, 2013 at 1:24 am #6600

    D

    My wife has more than a few of the typical symptoms of Estrogen Dominance and Adrenal Fatigue, so she decided to do a home saliva hormone test (via Canary Club).

    Her saliva test was done on the 20th day of her cycle and the results were:

    ============
    Female (34 yr old)

    Estradiol (saliva) 2.8pg/ml [RANGE: 1.3-3.3 Premenopausal (Luteal)]
    Progesterone (saliva) 80pg/ml [RANGE: 75-270 Premenopausal (Luteal)]
    Ratio: Pg/E2 (saliva) 29 [OPTIMAL: 100-500 when E2 1.3-3.3 pg/ml]

    Testosterone (saliva) 37pg/ml [RANGE: 16-55 (Age Dependent)]
    DHEAS (saliva) 5.6ng/ml [RANGE: 2-23 (Age Dependent)]

    Cortisol Morning (saliva) 9.3ng/ml [RANGE: 3.7-9.5]
    Cortisol Noon (saliva) 2ng/ml [RANGE: 1.2-3.0]
    Cortisol Morning (saliva) 0.7ng/ml [RANGE: 0.6-1.9]
    Cortisol Morning (saliva) 0.1ng/ml [RANGE: 0.4-1.0]
    ============

    I’m by no means an expert, but this seems to be a typical case of Adrenal Fatigue (very high morning cortisol, very low evening cortisol) and Estrogen Dominance (low progesterone to high estrogen). We believe her hormones got knocked out of whack when she briefly took birth control pills about 7 years ago, as she did not tolerate them very well.

    Since this doesn’t appear to be a serious hormone case (yet) it seems that it would be best for her to try herbal support before subjecting herself to bio-identical hormones. So, we were thinking Vitamin C for the Adrenals, and Pure Encapsulations DIM Detox to rid the body of excess estrogen. Additionally, an herbal female hormone support formula to support her low progesterone and normalize her hormones (the hormone support formula contains Dong Quai Root, Chaste Tree Berry, Wild Yam Root, Damiana Leaf, Licorice Root, Hops Flower).

    In a normal person, I believe the fix I outlined, above, would be pretty straightforward with few side effects. However, we recently discovered from 23andMe that she has CBS C699T (++)/MTHFR C677T (++) and BHMT-08 (+,+).

    (FYI, her other heterozygous methylation mutations can be seen here.)

    I’m not sure her CBS mutation is “switched on” since she feels perfectly healthy eating lots of eggs and sulfur-rich foods every single day.

    Nevertheless, I wonder if the DIM Detox supplement has supplements that a CBS (+,+)/MTHFR (+,+) individual should avoid.

    Here is the ingredient list for Pure Encapsulations DIM Detox:

    diindolylmethane complex 100 mg
    calcium-d-glucarate 100 mg.
    broccoli sprout concentrate 100 mcg. (standardized to contain a minimum of 400 mcg sulforaphane)
    HMRlignan™ 10 mg.
    7-hydroxymatairesinol (Norway spruce)
    alpha lipoic acid 200 mg. (thioctic acid)
    n-acetyl-l-cysteine (free-form) 200 mg.
    milk thistle (silybum marianum) extract (seed) 150 mg. (standardized to contain 80% silymarin)
    l-methionine (free-form) 200 mg.
    glycine (free-form) 100 mg.
    taurine (free-form) 100 mg.
    ascorbyl palmitate (fat-soluble vitamin C) 20 mg.

    The thing is, I believe all the ingredients, above, are necessary to support Phase I and Phase II detox. Yet, I believe some of those ingredients may not be ideal for someone with MTHFR (+,+)/CBS (+,+). Usually people with “switched on” CBS mutations typically can’t tolerate much sulfur and have too much taurine, but it doesn’t seem like her CBS is switched on.

    In any case, I curious about how one detoxes excess estrogen, via Phase I and Phase II when they have CBS C699T (+,+) and MTHFR C677T (+,+) mutations? And is it safe to take the DIM detox in her situation, when she doesn’t seem to react to sulfur-rich foods?

    I figure the answer — if there is one — will also be helpful for others with this common hormone problem. Thanks in advance!

    February 4, 2013 at 5:59 am #6604

    Allie

    I really don’t know about the supplement side of things – but do cut out everything that brings in estrogens from the environment. Don’t cook in plastic, eat organic to avoid chemicals in food, chuck out your household cleaners and work with just the basics like bicarb soda, don’t use any makeup with anything in it that you can’t pronounce, chuck the shampoo with the lauryl/laureth sulphates in it… look up Environmental Estrogens to find other ways of picking them up when you least expect it.

    Perhaps the simplest answer with the supplements, as we are all different, is to start with small doses and watch for side effects?

    I wish you all the best, Allie

    February 4, 2013 at 5:00 pm #6616

    MaryS

    Hi D. I personally would say your wife’s morning cortisol was only slightly low. It is actually in range. However, she does have very low cortisol at night. My cortisol is also fluctuating and I found ashwagandha to help the most. mine is the opposite though. Low in the morning and slightly high at night, but it used to be low at every single time, almost a flat line. I think addressing CBS is helping the adfenals. I also just started taking Thorne Phytisome and it seems to be helping. Is she taking DHEA? Hers is a little low.

    Regarding the CBS. I have it as well and I was eating a Paleo diet with tons of eggs before I discovered I had it. Never felt worse eating eggs, but it definately increased my sulfate levels. Your wife could get the quantofix sulfate strips to test her levels as she makes dietary changes. Cutting out eggs and egg white protein powder made my numbers go down. I only eat eggs now in my homemade gluten free bread or pancakes.

    I personally can not tolerate any detox blends. Im ++CBS and +- MTHfR C677T (i have 5 homo and 4 hetero mutations all together). I even tried straight milk thistle and felt terrible. After I was on the diet for a couple weeks I was able to take ALA, but when I added in methionine my sulfate strips numbers went up so I stopped taking it. The best thing I found for detoxing is doing coffee enemas. Sounds gross but I feel good afterwards and it’s like having dialysis on the liver. There is a lot of info on seeking health website on how they benefit and how to do it. I do one a week to keep my sulfate levels down. Let me know if you have more questions. dr Lynch recommended 1-2 a week when I had my consult with him.

    Regarding the hormones. My doctor recommended a hormone herbal blend called Pregnancy Prep in the past. It really helped so I just started again as I’m waiting for my hormone test results. It’s made by Vitanica. Really good product.

    I know everyone is different but I just wanted to let you know what has worked for me.

    MaryS

    February 8, 2013 at 5:29 pm #6758

    Dolores Seames

    You might want to go on MTHFRsupport face book page and ask you question directed to Shawn Bean. He has said that dim isn’t good for either CBS or COMT, and that he would recommend Calcium D-Glucerate instead. Not sure I spelled that right. Dim is too heavy in sulfure ingredients.

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